The CX status in the DACH region and about his podcast “CX-Talks” with Peter Pirner – S1E32

The CX Goalkeeper had a smart discussion with Peter Pirner

LinkedIn Headliner: CX Advisor⎮Speaker⎮ CX Coach ⎮Creator & Podcast Host (CX-Talks)⎮ CX is in my DNA. I help and inspire to create better customer experiences.

We discussed about:

  • “CX Talks”, Peter’s podcast in German
  • The development of CX in the DACH region
  • Some tangible insights on where to start and how to progress with a CX centric transformation
  • The possible next developments in CX
  • Examples of best practices

Shared book suggestion:

  • The Convenience Revolution, Shep Hyken
  • Customer Experience 3, Writing Matters

Peter’s golden nugget:

There is no ONE solution. If you meet a guy and he says, “this is the one solution”. This is not true. Throw him out. If he asks, “what is the problem?”, his suggestion may be part of a broader solution.

There is no ONE solution. If you meet a guy and he says, “this is the one solution”. This is not true. Throw him out. If he asks, “what is the problem?”, his suggestion may be part of a broader solution. @PirnerPeter on the CX Goalkeeper Podcast

How to contact Peter:

Thank you, Peter!

#customerexperience #leadership #cxgoalkeeper #cxtalks


Gregorio Uglioni 0:02
Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the CX goalkeeper podcast. Your host, Gregorio Uglioni. Will have small discussion with experts, thought leaders and friends on customer experience, transformation, innovation and leadership. I hope you will enjoy the next episode.

Ladies and gentlemen, today is really a big pleasure to have Peter Pirner with with me. We had a really great pre-discussion in the last 10 minutes, it will be a blast today speaking with him. Hi Peter, how are you?

Peter Pirner 0:42
Hi Greg, thank you for having me.

Gregorio Uglioni 0:46
Great pleasure. And as usual, I think it doesn’t make sense that I started reading all what you did in your career. And therefore my simple question, could you please introduce yourself?

Peter Pirner 0:57
Yeah, very glad to do that. Actually, I worked something like 25 years in a company, which is called Kantar, which is a market research company. And I was always active in the area of some of that satisfacion measurement, Consumer measurement, actually, I know all the all the tools and all the proceedings, how to gather information from about customer needs, and what they feel. And I had the big luck that Kantar is a huge company was part of WPP. So I had also global roles. So I had respond, I had global responsibility for the for the topic, customer experience management or customer satisfaction measurement. I did trainings all around the globe, I visited top clients of Canada, all around the world, I had very specific regional sales responsibility for southern Europe and Russia and Africa. So I saw the full picture of what happens in the customer experience world for many, many years. And then I returned back to Germany to run the German practice area. And in Germany, cantor, formerly known as in practice, is the second biggest player in Germany. So we had all the big DAX companies as our clients and I, again, the pleasure to be as an expert, this in a position to discuss and challenge some of the solutions they found for their organizations. And often 25 years, there was a reorganization. So I’ve seen everything, I’ve done everything, I love the company, I’ve loved what I’ve done. And they don’t want to take part of a reorganization. And so we decided that we find a way that I would leave the company with it in all friendship and without any, any hassle. And then I started to work on the one side in a company my nephew founded, which is an accessory company. And they started seven years ago, and the company became so big that we came into some troubles. And so I also jumped in with some of my seniority to go over the role of cmo Chief Technology Officer, Chief Marketing Officer, and Customer Experience Officer, that’s that’s more my thing. And at the same as what I don’t want to lose contact to the world I had before because I have so many connections, and I’m still really passionate about the topic. So I always wanted to be a radio moderator. Actually, when I started studying, I applied for the job as a radio moderator at the Bavarian radio station. I ended up number eight in they only took four. And this there was really a shame and after many, many years, I decided well, I don’t care this time I do my own radio program. Because I really like like voice I like audio I like good journalism on as you can find it on many podcast stations. And then I started also the podcasts, CX-talks. And there was quite helpful that I’m also partner of the Institute of customer experience management, which is a very relevant organization in Germany and Reinhard Kohlm the owner of the institute asked me if I would like to be a partner with him. So of course, I’m happy to do that. And so we offer that also as a service in the in the into the customer experience management that we have this content offer on a regular basis and this also one and a half years ago and I think today it’s now the most successful podcast about customer experience actually just in German, because we have the discussion is In German or not. So you see, I have many, many aspects in my life, I have seen a lot of things in the past, I still do some things in seeks with individuals, smaller projects for some clients. But mainly now I run a business and accessories from my podcast, and I’m active in the community.

Gregorio Uglioni 5:20
Yeah, I’m really, really glad to have you on this podcast. As you said, you have really big, big experience in all the different topics. And two of them, I would like to touch them. But before we with keep one of these topics in the shop that you mentioned, is Petlando for people living in, in Germany or in that region, it’s really interesting go on the website, you’ll see that it’s really customer experience at its best.

Peter Pirner 5:20
we are just b2b business, actually, we don’t have our own shop, we just do b2b. So you can buy that in all the shops in Germany, Austria, Switzerland, Belgium, Netherlands, it’s a pure b2b business. But at the same time, we really walk the talk. And there was also one of the key learnings, but maybe at a later point in time, I will bring some examples there, because this is what I learned. I was used to big, big, big organizations. And now all of a sudden, we are an organization, we are just we are right now 50 people. So very young, not too much theoretical balance, too much theoretical background on this topic. But they do a lot of things very well, just instinctively. And this is what we sometimes forget in customer experience management that you can do things right. Even if you don’t have a clue what the theory behind this,

Gregorio Uglioni 6:50
I think it’s important is to care about what customer needs. It’s a b2b or b2c world. But at the end, if you listen to the customer, and then you act on what customers are saying, then you’re already on the right side of the game.

Peter Pirner 7:04
Absolutely. Absolutely.

Gregorio Uglioni 7:06
Thank you. And I think I would like to quickly deep dive on your CX talks, because it’s really an interesting podcast. And I listen also to the to the last episode about the pharmacy. That was a really nice, nice one. Thank you very much for that. Where did where started the idea of having this cx talks, you mentioned that about the radio, but why specific on CX?

Peter Pirner 7:32
now because cx actually, as I said, my background is research. So actually, I and when I left camera, I was not obliged anymore, to focus all my thinking around the research solution. I noticed that I did that only after a while when I was outside of Kantar. When I saw Well, when I talk to clients, I always talked about actually the measurement area, new technologies you could bring in. And yes, we also talked about strategy. And we talked about change. But our core offer was actually rolling out in huge, huge, huge customer experience system, customer voice over customer systems at the global scale, which is really a very, very specific business. And then you add on some, some some smaller local insights pieces. And when I stepped out of control, I thought well, but they exist so much more. And the more you speak with people, you find out that everybody has a perspective on things, but it’s centered around what, what, where he’s coming from. And this was for me the reason to say, now you’re independent people now you can really drive to interview people. With no intention to sell anything, you can just make the whole picture for all and it’s, for me, it’s over the time I also found out I find it very rewarding. Speaking to people are passionate about what they are doing. And Jan Reuter is a wonderful example. Actually, I saw a few of his videos on LinkedIn. Only when we started the interview, I found out that he is also a professional speaker. I really did not put things that far because I found that the guy I found really interesting. And he also studied in Munich, so we have things things in common and when he describes what he does at a small level for a pharmacy, this has nothing to do with the business I did in Kantar. Or if Annika Tannenbaum talks about leadership in customer in contact centers. This has nothing to do with what we offered as a service but I know from my disk Because with clients and this is key to success of any system do you really need to understand all the different bits and pieces you need to bring the people together. And working in a network just like the customer experience, it’s your customer experience management also allows me to get into contact with people who have an offer that is really distinct to what I’ve done before. And the only thing what I learned about that is someone who says, I really understand what customer experience is, is lying because you just understand that perspective, just be open. And listen to many people, because you can take insights from so many different people and perspectives and experiences. And this is what I’ve tried to do in the podcast, I just invite people I personally find interesting. Or topics I really want to know something about. So the next podcast will be about the digital city. What is customer experience in a digital city? I wouldn’t have done that if I just make a podcast around market research methods and customer experience mountain.

Gregorio Uglioni 11:11
Sure. And I think this is also what it’s interesting in the customer experience science that you have so many different opportunities, aspects that you can discuss and share. But Peter, now it’s really time share your secret? How can you be so successful with your podcast, we want to know that.

Peter Pirner 11:30
I don’t know I I really don’t know. And it probably it probably helps that I do them with passion. They really like what I do. And I think people notice that. If you like what you do, and then try to make it as professional as possible. Without having agency being paid for making it professional, do everything myself just like you. And you know that it’s also quite some work in post production. And some work in preparation. And then it’s about treating people in the interview in I think these are the for me, these are the components that needs to be covered really well, in order to have a result that is appealing. And people notice that people feel well in an interview. And people also notice if there’s a structure in the interview. So I don’t like those podcasts that just Oh, Let’s improvise half an hour. Now that that doesn’t really work. At least for me, it doesn’t work. And I think that that helped to the grid, basic audience that connects to it. And it’s also a niche. It’s not just the niche customer experience is also the nice customer experience in German, because there are many fantastic podcasts in English. And that I thought, tried to do it differently, just do it in general. I could do that also in English, but I don’t want to do that in English. Also to link better to the audience in Germany, Austria and Switzerland. Because this is a region which is not really super ahead of everything. very frankly speaking. I’ve seen African clients that were more ahead than German clients some years ago, in terms of how they, they they structured their organization on. But we are growing and many things are really happening in this area right now. There are a lot of excellent examples of of companies who really work on on the on their systems and on their their organizations. And so I thought, well, that’s my niche. And I hope that these are the spices that were needed to make it festive.

Gregorio Uglioni 14:07
At least you have one fan, it’s me because I am a recurring listener of your podcast. And I think this is one important thing being a recurring listener and not only once, and thank you very much for naming my pot podcast. That’s fantastic because I’m doing it in English. And you said to our fantastic podcast in English.

Peter Pirner 14:27
I’m free. And I do once a month I do podcasts recommendation, I just recommend the ones I really liked. Because I listened to something so that’s that’s cool. For example, I found yours within a difference. I really liked that. And I also like for example, from manager magazine. They made one one episode on LinkedIn and then everybody says you’re so fantastic and user fantastic. Everybody makes everybody feel you’re fantastic because hopefully you’re fantastic and it was so fantastic. I can’t it’s so funny that I put that also into this list. Because I liked it. And that is actually it’s probably most mostly it’s me the list. And I really liked like the podcasting you made with another. And also, you can notice that you like what you do. And I think that that’s the important thing.

Gregorio Uglioni 15:22
Thank you very much, Peter, I will transcribe everything and put that as a feedback.

Peter Pirner 15:27
Yeah, absolutely. Review Management, that’s the area of Review management.

Gregorio Uglioni 15:34
Exactly. Thank you, Peter. I think it’s really an outstanding outstanding podcast CX talks, and you have a global experience. You had a global experience. And now you’re focusing on the dark region, Germany, Austria and Switzerland. And you already mentioned there are fantastic examples of companies doing customer experience. Before we started mentioning companies, what’s your view of the development of customer experience in our region?

Unknown Speaker 16:06
I think I know best the German situation. I have some ideas about the situation in Switzerland, which is, from my point of view, companies that are very active in that area are quite international companies. Headquarters, which we also serve from Germany. So I’ve been to headquarters in Switzerland, where they have these huge programs, probably mostly based on customer on huge customer feedback systems that need to be introduced into global organizations, or at least at a regional level in huge organizations. And for that reason, in Switzerland, you would find more people coming from all over the places. So the thinking was a bit more advanced, or it was more established, than you would probably find that in German medium sized companies. But the big ones is also without a discount, these are the same people, the same breed. What I find is that it’s quite logical and easy that you start with Voice of the Customer programs, because actually, you cannot be customer centric, if you don’t have feedback from a customer. This is just a contradiction in itself. If you don’t, if you don’t give your customer have the opportunity to tell you what he needs, then you by definition, are not customer centric. And the next step, then will be if you understood what he said, what they said, then you decide what you want to fulfill. And then you need to perform, you just need to deliver. So in US, UK, the maturity of the VOC programs are already quite mature. These these problems were already quite mature, something like 10 years ago. And some of the discussions we had in these countries. We saw then, in countries that were heavily influenced by these countries, for example, in Dubai, we had discussions about the optimization of certain programs that were very similar to the things we discussed in the UK or the United States. The Germans, and probably also, the Swiss and the Austrians start slightly later, but they also had in the past, they had some customer satisfaction programs in place. And the biggest difference was that customer satisfaction programs were done. Once in a year, or every half year, it was not an ongoing tracking, it was anonymous. And it should help you to understand maybe customer segments, maybe specific needs change of needs over time. And the totally new idea was, you now need to have personalized feedback. And you need to push that back into the organization. And if you put something back into the organization and the organization is not prepared, then you feel the goodwill of your clients because they told you what they want, but there is no one who takes up on their responses. The organization is completely nervous because it even more so if you start immediately with a bonus system based on customer feedback, which by the way, I think is still xxxxx. Mmm. But you can overwhelm an organization if you move from the more strategic relationship approach to the ongoing short interview after transaction. And that was the passion for the new shiny object that was introduced into the dark region. Also, it’s also true for France, it’s also true for Italy. It’s also true. I would say also for, for all the major European markets, they were still in the most strategic perspective. And then we came into the ongoing feedback. And as this is the next step, which does not solve all your problems, neither, but actually, this is just the next step, then all the discussion started and 10 years ago, in the US, or in the UK, you could be people with a job title Customer Experience Manager. Today, I would say you can find people in the data region with a job title Customer Experience Manager. And yes, everybody complains, it’s not totally clear what you should do, and how much are you should have and how much resources he should have. But actually, that is not a difference to what is going on in the United States or in the UK, that’s an ongoing problem. But as years ago, it was really very rare that you could find people, or you could find roles that you could apply to, which add some sort of customer experience management as a role description. And this is really makes a difference. And this makes the whole thing very interesting. And this is where that is now, moving quick asked. Of course, it’s also supported a bit by the fact that all the technology provider beads, Medallia bead, marriage speed, Qualtrics, speed, confirm and beat, there are so many technology platforms or in moment, they have a very strong marketing machine. So not everybody feels a bit also the need that they should do something. And now the next big challenge will be to understand it’s not just a technology problem, it is also a technology problem. But it’s not just the technology problem. And I think in other countries, where you have already implemented a system with ongoing feedback, for example, and you just change the provider, that the situation is already a different situation. And in the UK or US, you cannot just change the providers in DACH still build these systems. In many cases.

Gregorio Uglioni 22:56
I really like what you’re saying, because you touched the old phases also have an introduction of such such a solution. We spoke about the strategic piece, the operational piece, and not only, let’s say listening, but also acting on what it’s doing. And you mentioned something that I really like and for me is key. And it’s always what I’m saying technology is the mean and not the solution. With the technology, you can start introducing new solution getting feedback from the customer. But what it’s done irrelevant is what does the company wants to achieve? First of all, that’s the bit division and the strategy. And then also the governance hours organized and that’s what you mentioned, what are the roles and responsibilities of customer experience team and then coming also to the cultural aspect that now customer are something like free of charge consultants giving you feedback, and then it’s up to you as a company to action to action that

Peter Pirner 23:59
absolutely, absolutely.

Gregorio Uglioni 24:01
And and based on everything what you said and also seeing and I share your view that for example, UK, Dubai and us are one step I had or several step if compared to us. You already mentioned quite a lot of actionable insights. Do you have an idea what will be the next topics that will come to our region?

Peter Pirner 24:30
I was always wondering because actually as now I have my radar broader in insights. I would say very clearly, it will be the return of the quantitative research. And will be NPS will not be the overwhelming one. One solution for everything. They will be much More, you will have communities, we will have more qualitative research, you will re start your strategic research, because you will find out that it’s a combination of all that that’s the Insight piece on the technology piece, I wonder, I think we will see a lot of software as a service providers or parts of customer experience management. So, also Qualtrics or Medallia will develop even more into Process Management machines. It will, because on all the inside platforms, they are already quite active. So, actually, there cannot be too much innovation, you can introduce millions of new statistical methods in, in a program. But if you didn’t have the right apotheosis, it really doesn’t matter if it’s there. And sometimes just trendlines already so much telling you, the situation company is you don’t need highly sophisticated statistical measures that nobody understands. So then the logical step to expand will be more into process management. I think what we also would see more is the integration. We talked about that. I mean, we’ve talked about that, since I’m 20 years old. This was management information system. I mean, there are always different labels for things, the integration of data and the holistic management system, the holistic management dashboard that helps you with everything, I think we come in closer and closer to solutions to that in the beginning, it was just a vision. Now, it can be realized. The question is, does that solve all your problems? No, you just have relevant KPIs, and you still need that. But in the past, you couldn’t create these KPIs. Now you can create these KPIs, at least many of them. And also, that will be really interesting when what we see there, and this happening, not only in Germany, this happens all over the place. It’s also in the years. And there are still a lot of promises in the room. But I think we also see now some deliveries. So I’m quite pleased that they will be interesting. And the topic of organizational developments, new ways of working, transforming an organization into these new ways of working, will be more and more important. Because only then we can adapt to the new needs customers have.

Gregorio Uglioni 28:01
I think this is this is really key what you’re saying. And I’m also saying this development, perhaps to make that a bit understandable? Do you have some really good examples, let’s name them best practices of companies working on such a roadmap.

Peter Pirner 28:22
think most of the companies or the bigger companies work somewhere in their organizations and Israel. I met many departments in big global organizations, where all the knowledge was there. But they could not bring it to life, because they could not make a relevant enough use case for the organization of politics. Just stop them. So some of these new developments probably sit somewhere in it somewhere in the somewhere in strategy. And if you’re lucky, these departments talk to each other and have the common goal to unite. And this changes was the people working there, or the the leaders working in these departments. And it must be very clear, the vision must be very clear that we want to do that as a company. We want to base two subsets of our company on what we understand of our customers. We want to do everything possible to bring that all the relevant points in our organization to make that work in I think, probably Amazon as far as I can see that it’s always brought up as an excellent example. I think Amazon is really Next for them example, because we talk all about that, and they always tried to improve and they try things. Stupidity doesn’t work. They are very adaptive. They study means that others don’t do that at all. This is just one of the examples I know and where I really have the feeling that they also walk the talk. But I’ve seen also, as you’ve seen, also, in my podcast, I have a huge background on the automotive industry, and then know that all the automotive manufacturers have their departments, they work on that. And they try to bring them the organization. But these organizations are really complicated. Because you have country organizations, you have sales and after sales. And this is true for most of the industries. So if you want to bring that to life, then it takes a lot of time, and maybe it frustrates you more than it should, because it’s like a 60 foot work, you just need to do that if it doesn’t make the work better, if you stop that, then the world will be worse. And probably it will take a lot of effort just to keep things moving. And I think the activity level of an organization, for me is more relevant criteria to say they are in a good way or not. And I think most of the most of the bigger companies do that, as they need to do. The smaller companies do that anyway, if they wouldn’t do that, it’s also much easier, they don’t have so many silos also they have silos, if you have a team of 50, you start creating silos. But much easier to jump over silos in a smaller, small company. And if you’re 1000 employees, you’re not a small company anymore. But you can act a bit faster. And you have someone in management who says I want that, then this happens. This is not the case, in a huge organization where all the decisions need to be politically aligned. And you need to have the buying of more people in the management board. And

Gregorio Uglioni 32:27
it’s something like a master class. Thank you very much, Peter, because you are bringing so many insights. And taking the last two that you mentioned, one is lead by example of the leadership needs support it, and what you mentioned that I really like. And it’s also my personal experience, it doesn’t make big difference. If you’re a big company, if you’re a small company, you have different budgets, different tools, but then at the end, the feedback of the customer is key. And a company a big company needs to do that in a more structured way. A really small company, let’s say this mall shopping in the town where we are living, perhaps they ask you, were you happy with your last, the last thing that you bought? And then you give feedback? Can you get feedback, and and at the end, they can improve? improve them themselves pharmacy? Exactly, exactly. And also closing the loop. And concluding this first part of the discussion. You mentioned Amazon, and it’s clear, it’s always we are we’re always mentioning Amazon as as the example. But if they are the best in class, they are in the best in class. And thinking about the last letter that Jeff Bezos wrote to the shareholders, it’s really extremely interesting to read it. I learned a lot by reading that. And I suggest to the community to have to have a look at it. Now it’s time to learn a bit more about you better and this is what I like from this discussion in sort of the human touch. You are a super expert, and you will demonstrate that in the last half an hour. And but now we would like to learn a bit more about you. And the first question I would like to ask about you is you mentioned at the beginning you have you’re active in several fields. How can you ensure to have a satisfactory work life balance?

Peter Pirner 34:14
I’m in control. Today I’m in control. Petlando, I am owner and I own part of the company and I can decide how much I want to do this deal with my nephew. And CX talks if it’s too much I can stop it. Or if and I also want to have a certain degree of freedom to jump on. Other topics to discuss these people or other topics for example right now I’m also working with a Swiss management consultancy. Excellent. They have a fantastic product. About touch point now Which one? Just to understand a bit how we can make that even more digestible for German clients? Or does it need to be somehow enhanced to be acceptable for German clients? For me, that is I still do not work my 80 hours, which I did in the years before that actually probably work my, my, my part of my, my work life already. And for that reason, I feel right now I feel quite fine with balancing it out. But it’s a challenge for yourself to say no fear of missing out, do I need to be there in order to be there next time, don’t need to be everywhere, quiet. And really blessed with having been in so many places already. And so for that reason, I’m actually I also do some coaching to people who are new in some of their position testing. Did you think about that, think about that. This is something I did before also encounter. So I was mentoring coach there. And I do that, again, just because I like it. Because I find it really fascinating seeing 27 year old guys developing a business, or 30 year old high potentials, having the first first time in the life that someone says no, this is not the end of your career, which is not true. But those ambitions one will have the press frustrations in their jobs in their service, or they are extremely successful than they had years later, doesn’t matter. But you will start having frustrations in your career, I have that myself as well. And as long as you can enrich your life with these different aspects without the goal, I need to be the most successful man in the world in this organization. This gives you also the Congress just to say no. Today, I don’t want to do anything today just want to be in the sun.

Gregorio Uglioni 37:14
I fully agree with you. And I we already have a topic for the next podcast definition of success. Because exactly what what you’re saying

Peter Pirner 37:23
that we’re here, but it’s, it’s really it’s good to separate discussion, because what is success, and it changes over time? I mean, if you would have asked me 20 years ago, I would have to find a completely different. And it’s absolutely the right of the young people. And I think it’s now the time of the people in the 30s and 40s. To change the organization to change the world, not the guys in the 60s, or in the 70s we should run organizations and they shouldn’t even run the countries. As we’ve seen in the past.

Gregorio Uglioni 37:57
Exactly in discussion with Pascal Kaufmann, he was telling me the words belongs to the younger generation, we should ask the right question and give them direction with our experiences. And I think this is key. And as you said, for me success 10 years ago, 15 years ago was different to now for me now. It’s also success, opening the door and having quality time with my family with my with my small son. And before that, I was not aware that it’s also success. Yeah. Thank you better. And now the next question would be, is there a book that he would suggest to the audience and say, This is a book you should read? Because I learned something or it’s full of insights,

Peter Pirner 38:43
I really need to disappoint you. Actually, I I wrote my, when I wrote my PhD thesis, I read so many books, when I said two things I learned I don’t want to read standard books anymore. And I don’t want to write a standard book. In there, I don’t want to do that anymore. And frankly speaking, I don’t read these long. I don’t read the books. What I do read is articles house, because I think I like it, people need to condense their insight because in a book, you just need to pump it up so that you end up with at least 120 pages. And in reality, the key messages are always very short than the thing that I’ve seen that and so for that reason, I still really like HBR Harvard Business Review, they have great content and follow that and some other publications and posts and for that reason, very honestly, I could not give you a good read Pronunciation of Fox, probably you are the better choice. If I ask you, what do you order? What is your last reading you really enjoy.

Gregorio Uglioni 40:09
First of all, supporting you supporting you, then I would say, Let’s suggest CX Talks as a podcast. And, and I think this is something that really something that helps. I am trying to differentiate I, as you said, I really like to reading post podcasts and so on because you need to really compensate your message. What I’m reading now is a book of Shep Hyken, the convenience revolution. And there from Shep, what I really like is the way I was writing with this great examples. And then after the example, also the learnings, and then you have really a bigger overview what is happening also, in the companies that our state of the art already in customer experience. Therefore this this is my suggestion. Thank you for the question.

Peter Pirner 41:01
Thank you for helping me with a question on the book.

Gregorio Uglioni 41:04
And for sure. If you’re asking my recommendation is customer experience 3, because I am co author of this of this book. We published that in March. And therefore I need to mention that. Joke aside. If Peter, if somebody would like to contact you, what’s the best way to contact you?

Peter Pirner 41:24
To the website, We are LinkedIn. That’s the best way. Very happy for any kind of discussions, whatever it is, because that’s me, I say no. But I’d like to, let’s say yes, if I love

Gregorio Uglioni 41:42
it’s also our I contacted you through LinkedIn. And and it’s great to have to have such.

Peter Pirner 41:48
I think that that’s also the nice thing about LinkedIn, in the last year, I met so many people, and you’re one of them, because actually, I saw what you’ve done. So I somehow had an idea. But the nice thing is only after this podcast and are fairly senior, I have a better feeling for the person behind. And that’s a nice thing in podcasting that you learn interesting people and after that you have a different relations and before.

Gregorio Uglioni 42:12
Sure, and this is what I really like. And we’re coming to the last question is the question I always ask. And this is Peter, golden nugget, it’s something that we already discussed are something that he would like to share with the audience that we didn’t discuss. And it’s the lead law, last piece of wisdom from you.

Peter Pirner 42:31
First of all, I am not a wise guy. And there is not the one solution. If you meet someone who says this is the one solution, not true. Just throw them out. There is nothing like the one solution. If he asked you what is your problem. And he says, Well, my solution might solve your parts of the solution that brings you much further down the road than then listening to some of the I have a solution for for all the problems you have in this area. That is what I learned in my past. And this is why Customer Experience Management. If you understand that, as broad as it is, then it’s logical that there cannot be just one single solution.

Gregorio Uglioni 43:22
Thank you very much, Peter. And as usual, I’m not commenting your golden nugget because it’s Peter golden nugget. The last thing I want to say is thank you very much for your time, Peter, also during your vacation.

Peter Pirner 43:35
Thank you very much. Bye bye.

Gregorio Uglioni 43:36
It was a great pleasure and also to the audience. I hope that you enjoyed this discussion as much as I did, because it was really an outstanding discussion. And thank you very much.

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