Episode released on: 29. May 2023
Unleashing Creativity and Innovation: Exploring the Power of Lego Serious Play with Sirte Pihlaja – Customer Experience Goals with the CX Goalkeeper
The CX Goalkeeper had the great opportunity to interview Sirte Pihlaja
LinkedIn Headline: CEO I CCXP I Trained LEGO® Serious Play® Facilitator I Global #1 BestSelling Author I Global Top 150 CX Expert I International Keynote I Board Member I CXPA Finland Lead I Championing CX in Caribbean, Europe & SE Asia
Highlights:
00:00 Game Start
00:38 Sirte’s Introduction
05:02 Sirte’s Values
09:19 Lego Serious Play LSP
14:42 Flow
16:00 The power of playing in Business
18:11 Where to use it
21:34 Experiencing Lego Serious Play LSP
23:53 The Role of Happiness
26:18 Customer Experience Management benchmark
29:04 The Future of CX
31:57 Book Suggestion
32:17 Books’ Suggestion
34:03 Contact Details
35:02 Golden Nugget
and much more
Sirte’s Contact Details:
Her book suggestion:
- Customer Experience 2 by Writing Matters
- Customer Experience 3 by Writing Matters
- Customer What? by Ian Golding
Sirte’s Golden Nuggets:
- I believe that creativity is inherent to each individual from birth. Thus, it is merely a matter of us tapping into our inner five-year-old selves to discover and unleash the creativity that resides within all of us.
Creativity is inherent to each individual from birth. Thus, it is merely a matter of us tapping into our inner five-year-old selves to discover and unleash the creativity that resides within all of us. @sirteace on the CX Goalkeeper Podcast
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What did we discuss?
Gregorio Uglioni
Ladies and gentleman, welcome to the CX goalkeeper podcast your host, Greg will have smart discussions with friends, experts and thought leaders on customer experience transformation and leadership. Please follow this podcast on your preferred platform. I am sure you will enjoy the next episode with the guest I selected for you,
Ladies and gentleman tonight, it’s really a big, big pleasure because I have Sirte together with me. Hi Sirte, how are you?
Sirte Pihlaja
Hi, Gregorio. I’m fine. Thank you for for inviting me for this podcast.
Gregorio Uglioni
Finally, you are joining the podcast after we collaborate also for customer experience 3 together for the book, I know that you wrote also customer experience too. And now finally, we find time together to discuss about that super interesting topic. Let’s start the game. Let’s start the play. Let’s start playing and speaking about LEGO serious play. But before we deep dive in this topic, we would learn a bit more about you and therefore see if they could you please quickly introduce yourself?
Sirte Pihlaja
Sure. So my name is Sirte Pihlaja. For those who want to know how to pronounce it. I have to say CEO and founder of Shirute. That that is the first customer experience agency in Finland. And I’ve been my background is actually in journalism, whether you’re working for the Finnish broadcasting company for the BBC for Radio France International. So I have a very long background, doing things for for different kinds of audiences. And over 25 years now, I’ve been advising international companies and organizations into creating, you know, better customer experiences for them in quite a wide range of industries. And what I do is basically anything and everything between CX related strategy work and design, the X design, e x design, Voice of Customer programs, customer performance, customer dialogue, related projects, and we also do customer intelligence, so big data and, and nowadays more, we’re hopefully doing more and more of these machine customer AI related stuff as well. And not certainly also the employee experience, because we see that as a very important part of the whole people experiences. thing. Other than that, I’m a global CX ambassador, like you said, we have been writing books together two of the books that I’ve written our global best bestseller, CX two and CX three. And I’ve also written a third book in Finnish, about customer experiences. And I’m a keynote speaker in various international CX awards, ceremonies, I’ve been judged on the panel panel or the judge, panel leader, and also very keen proponent on the cxpa of the global cxpa. So I was one of the founding members of the association. And I’d be helping out as a as the one of the International Advisory Board members, when that was still existing. And I’ve been running the CSP in Finland, a local network since 2013. So for for 10 years already, right now. And also, within the CSP, I have been helping out other parts of the world. So cxpa in Asia, when they were starting some of the local networks I was trying to support them. And now here that, that I live here now in Barbados, I’m helping out to to fund the cxpa in the Caribbean.
Gregorio Uglioni
Oh, that’s super interesting. And I think what you’re saying it’s extremely interesting, because that’s also my feeling everywhere, there is something international related to CX going on, you are in the background and things support and connecting people. And therefore I know that, and we know, and we really appreciate what
Sirte Pihlaja
Thank you, thank you. It’s a big passion for me. And when I see that, again, here, here in the Caribbean, the situation is pretty much the same as it was back in the day in Finland when they were when we were just starting the activities there. It was first to introduce really cx to everybody in anybody in the region, and then starting to create these events and webinars and and all of that. We did actually do two global CX days, back in 2020. And find the one that was great fun, we got all the biggest CX stars to join us as speakers and we had people coming from all over from from Latin America to to the Asia and the Nordics all the way to South Africa. So I love bringing people together and especially when it’s all about CX and which is my great passion?
Gregorio Uglioni
And you’re already sharing the answer to the next question, but I will formulate it anyhow. Because that’s something that I think we preach always about values and the importance of the purpose. And you are already sharing that. But I asked, the question is which values drives you in life?
Sirte Pihlaja
Well, I would say, for on the personal side of my life, it’s really friends and family. I think that all all my passion for CX starts there, I’ve always wanted to, you know, make things better for everybody that I know. So it’s been a long time, a long time endeavor. And I think that ultimately, all we do is really something that we do to create a better future for our children. So trying to then do that in my professional life. And on that side, I would say that, well, you probably heard me say several times already how Finland has been selected as the happiest country on Earth. And now it’s the sixth consecutive year that that has happened on the United Nations World Happiness Index. So we are of course, very proud proud about that, and happy about that. But really, happiness is something that I do consider a very important value, as I want to make people happy. That’s, that’s my whole purpose in life. And so that’s also there for the purpose of shoedazzle as a company. And I’ve tried to do that through CX better CX and UX. And because I really think that if you are happy, you are much more likely to have the time to look around yourself, and you know, reach out to other people, and help them to become happy and prosperous, and all of that. So I consider that very important. Another thing, Finn’s, I think famous for being quite reliable and trustworthy people. So I do think also that, well, you don’t hear in Finland, people don’t leave your you don’t leave your friends behind, you know, and you they will always be famous will always have your back, whatever the situation is. So that is trust is really another thing that is important to me. And of course, being being the expert side of things, I don’t want to call myself a consultant, because it has certain connotations that I don’t like so much, I much rather be a personal, personal trainer kind of expert on the like your goalkeeper podcast is a really fun place to say that, but I really think that trust is something that you have to gain. And that is something that you one needs to have on the client side as well, because I couldn’t be working with, you know, some of our clients that have hundreds and millions of customers on on their company companies. So so if I didn’t do that, but also I think that extends to the partner, partner level in the sense that I do trust all of my and I would never select the partner that I didn’t trust 100% So that is very thing, I think that I’m very committed to and then maybe thirdly, three C’s. So curiosity, creativity and courage. There’s I think that Well, I, my my, my whole thing is about training about it’s about talking to leadership teams to make them understand that they have to be more more courageous and more creative that in their work so that they wouldn’t be able to be changed, make changes transformations and, and behave differently themselves. Because it all starts from the top. If people see you know, on the grassroots level that hey, they are talking about CX and E X and how important this is, but nothing really shows then they are not taking the bold step to change things for real. And I think you need to be also courageous to be creative, which I’m so sure we’ll be talking talking a little bit later. But in CX and in business life in general, I think that you need to think differently than others to really differentiate yourself. So you have to think a little bit out of the box as well.
Gregorio Uglioni
Thank you very much and I think now the team is complete we have the trainer and the goalkeeper and then we can we can we can start the game. And we can start speaking about LEGO serious play. I have also a small child is six years old, a really like and enjoying playing that but not it’s not what we are going to discuss today we are going about adults playing with Legos and creating things that means also something and I would like to really to understand this process. I know a lot of companies are already using it. But some companies don’t know it, don’t use it. And therefore it’s I think really interesting to deep dive in this in these methods. Could you please share what is Lego serious play?
Sirte Pihlaja
Yes, of course, Lego Serious Play is a creative methodology that Lego created themselves for themselves in the mid 1990s or so. So they invited two university professors, Mr. Johan Rose and Mr. Bart Victor’s to create it. So it’s based on sound academic theories. I think there’s 20-30 Different kinds of theories about behind it. But the most important of them is flow. Because you kind of have to get into that state of flow to be able to be more creative. And when you do you really launch yourself into it. Totally. The reason why they needed this methodology was that they were on the brink of bankruptcy almost. And they needed to make big changes in their organization. And they needed to make them fast. And I’m not saying that it was the only thing that turned the company around. But it was 111 great tool in making those changes happen. And we all know how Lego is doing nowadays. So. So I guess there has been some some useful use of it. For them. Lego serious play, to really quickly explain it is about creating, you’re utilizing less specialized Lego bricks, different kinds of models that are your answers to the challenges that the facilitator puts forth for you. And I always start my workshop saying that I’m going to be teaching you a new, totally new language today. Because that is, in fact, what it’s all about, because you’re talking through your hands. And like, it’s a totally different way of expressing yourself. And also it is a way of making things become concrete, your thoughts become concrete in a very, very, very concrete fashion. The way Lego serious play workshop advanced is that you start always with the skills building set as part because if you don’t have scales building, it’s not like a serious play for real. So you have to understand what what is like construction, constructivism on metaphors, what is storytelling, and all of that, once people are done, done these like short exercises to understand all of the plate that is in play with we put the challenges in front of them, and they start building their answers to them. And the idea is that everybody wants their they have built their models, they explain them to everybody else around the table. And then everybody else needs to listen very carefully and not, you know, they can ask questions about the models, but they are not to make any judgmental comments or anything like that. That’s one of the main key principles of Lego series play that we are trying to create this safe environment for everybody to express themselves on their opinions. So it is one of the main key things really in Lego serious play, then, when everybody has explained, the next round is most often about creating a shared model where everybody is points of view are put into this bigger model together based on those smaller models. And then yet another round would be to create agents around those that model that what are the different things that and I’m really focusing on my, the word agent doesn’t mean here, a person, it might be a law, it could could be a cultural thing. It could be resources, budgeting, you know, all of these things. So agents that affects the whole model. And then we do connections between the different parts of the Lego shared, shared model. And then the idea is that there’s a lot of reflection going on, although the whole the whole time. So we try to then create this last table guiding principles based on that. And that basically, is what what is the one of the key deliverables in Lego serious play workshops, we could be also doing some scenarios around the model. So playing different kinds of things that might happen to that specific model in real life. Or then things that are totally out there in you know, moonshots and things like that. But then, the idea being that we are really trying to play the different futures together out so that they wouldn’t happen in the or if they do happen in the real life, then you would be prepared for that already.
Gregorio Uglioni
Thank you. I think we are feeling the passion, you are spreading patient and let us please make one or two step backs because you explained the methodology, how it’s working. You mentioned something at the beginning or two topics that I would quickly, deep dive together with you really quick but to make the time understandable also for for the audience. You mentioned flow, perhaps could you please explain quickly explain what do you understand with the word flow?
Sirte Pihlaja
I think most of your listeners probably know what it is no even better than me that what it’s all about. But it’s this theory created by Mikael Mikulov scheme and I won’t try to pronounce the name is way too difficult, you can Google that up. But he, he’s the kind of founding father for it. And basically, what he’s saying is that, when you do things, you, if you’re too skilled for what you do, and you’re not kind of putting all of yourself into it, then you become easily very bored. But but if you’re all the time trying to do things at the level where your skills are, or even going a little bit further than that, then that helps you become more energized than putting all of your kind of effort into it. So that you will be more likely to produce better results is well basically, the idea there,
Gregorio Uglioni
that’s better because we are in the flow. And we can explain why, what, what flow is. And the second thing, and I know that it’s also perhaps already at the beginning, you mentioned that, but at the end, what you are doing is you are bringing play into business, moving, unlocking creativity, giving the opportunity to participants also to learn quicker, learning a new language. And indeed, I know that it’s not team building, it’s really about creating results. But could you quickly, please elaborate also on why it’s important to bring this way of playing into business?
Sirte Pihlaja
I think that we don’t have enough creativity in business life. So that’s, that’s the number one problem that this is bound to kind of solve for companies that we had we it could be any I mean, basically, it could be any creative methodology. But I just happen to know Lego serious play the best. And come to think of it actually the creators of Lego serious play or LSP. For short, they said that you could actually use any kind of material for Lego serious play that, you know, it could be parts like cotton, or it could be I don’t know, paper clips, I know that during the COVID times, people were doing online LSP. And sometimes the packages of Legos could not not get delivered in time, or they wouldn’t for some other reason have the Lego Lego bricks on their hands while participating. So people were using books, and you know, all of that whatever you have at hand you can use for playing, because it is all about metaphor. So I could say to you that okay, I don’t know if you see this, but like, like this airport box that I have here that this is actually a polar bear. You know, because I’m saying it is. So from from now on, when I’m giving you this story, it’s going to be about this polar bear that is doing something. Okay, that’s not exactly a, you know, business kind of example, but just something that makes you understand that it could be anything really,
Gregorio Uglioni
no, I think that’s thank you for this explanation. And perhaps also to make that understandable for for students. Which challenges can you solve with Lego, Lego serious play.
Sirte Pihlaja
I would like love to say anything and everything. But I’m not one of those people who say you know that you need this hammer for for for those nails. But I have not yet come to, to meet anything, like a business challenge that couldn’t be solved using Lego serious play. I think it’s more of a question of the company culture, that in some companies or organizations, they are more likely to kind of embrace new methodologies, being more open to being like, trying to be creative, and all of that. But I have had banks as customers. So you wouldn’t think that that’s the, you know, the nest of creativity, but those people have loved those Lego serious pay workshops. So I think that it’s if you take like, like the methodology as itself, it started from from being used for strategy work, firstly, and that’s where its foundations are. But then very, very quickly, Lego realized that actually, you can’t have strategy without changing transforming the culture as well. So very fast. It was also there were applications created, that can be used for team development and for individual individual development. And then also, another thing that they realized was that there are these big changes that are going on mergers, acquisitions, for fusion of organizations, other reasons why, you know, there are big changes and maybe controversial changes happening in take the pandemic in organizations. So therefore, they created a another application called the beast, it has a funny name, but basically, that is what it’s meaning that we are going to now take this piece and get, you know, solve this problem together. So, so those are like the generic ones, there’s a lot of HR related things that can be done with it, really driving transformational changes is what is best suited for. And what we do in with our clients is basically, those undertones but then we have created our own application called the CX play, which is then addressing all the customer experience and employee experience related needs. So it could be, you know, Persona creation, it could be customer journey mapping or management. It could be CX strategy, work CX design, we have been doing prototyping with some some companies, it’s a very good tool for prototyping as you can imagine. Using those creations also, I know that it is really helpful for for Scenario work. So that is something that I would consider or recommend doing doing with, because it’s one of the foundations where the Lego series plays this scenario, work
Gregorio Uglioni
experience with with with Lego Lego serious play, what was your best experience with Lego series play?
Sirte Pihlaja
My best one, you know, some of the some of the when you when you’re sitting as a as a participant, because I regularly take these advanced training modules where I’m actually a participant myself, so we get to, to experience our sales, what the what the newest applications are. So the best things that we have been doing there, I can’t remember anything like single things. But the feeling that you get when you’re being putting being put forward with a with a challenge. And then you have absolutely no idea what to respond. And the one of the, maybe the second rule of Lego serious play is Don’t think just build. So you just get yourself a bunch of Lego bricks, and you start fiddling with your fingers. And then you realize that this is actually talking through your hands. Because when you look at look down on the table, you realize that, hey, there’s a model, I don’t know where it came from. But this is like, this is my response to this thing. And, and I know what I’m talking about, and this is exactly what my response is for this challenge. When you get that it’s maybe a question of flow coming back to that, that thing, because when you see people that they’re running around getting more breaks, and you’re like, Oh my God, I don’t know what to respond, then you just, you know, launch yourself into it, and you come up with a response, even not knowing yourself what you have been doing. So on the participant side, I would say that it’s kind of that would be my best answer. As a facilitator, I love when I see the fun that people are having and how engaged they become, you know, they get all over all over the place with with their joy and, and get these ideas. And it’s not one, like one time only, it’s been several times that I’ve been getting people after the workshop telling me that they’ve never given so much out of them. And they really got into that state of flow. So that is really what was happening there. So yeah,
Gregorio Uglioni
it’s so nice, because while you’re speaking, I can see you the podcast colleagues or the the audience listening to the podcast they cannot cannot see that. But you are laughing, you are really laughing while you are explaining that. And they and it’s really great. And what to continue on this on this flow on this discussion. You mentioned that that’s also really important for your company, the role of happiness, and that you want to drive that for people around you. What’s the role of happiness in businesses?
Sirte Pihlaja
Well, first of all, I think on the employee side, it’s so important that people are happy, like I said earlier on that they are much more willing to think about their customers than if they don’t have a grudge against their boss or somebody that is their colleague, it really helps teams perform better because they open up new avenues of communication. And it can help people to talk about things that maybe would be more difficult to talk about, you know, if you didn’t have the LEGO model in front of you. You know weights a catalyst for change that that helps this driving these discussions, I would say, people get, you know, less stressed, stressed out, when they can really express themselves, they get to launch into this creative, you know, sessions, that they they, it’s a different way of working, I would say. Of course, then then the, it will, like I said, it’s not a team building exercise, but it is pound bound to make your communication better and your collaboration better. So in a way it is doing that the same thing as team building, like, like traditional team building exercises will do. That I think is very important. And that will then you know, in a long, longer, long run, then of course drive also the growth of the companies because people are willing to put much more of them. And then you get new ideas when you have new perspectives to things. And you get told those more maybe introverted people join you as well when they know that or they have that same feeling of safety. And they don’t you know Kindred, hid themselves from from joining the crowd and telling their opinions.
Gregorio Uglioni
Thank you, I would have 200,000 additional question. I still have some for you. But we are running out of time. The first question looking in the future short term, I know that you are going to launch maturity model, benchmarking Customer Experience Management shortly. As a matter of fact that you are on this podcast, I need to add to this question, can you highlight what’s what’s your purpose what you’re going to do?
Sirte Pihlaja
Sure, of course, so the same benchmark Customer Experience Management benchmark is something that we have been doing since the beginning of cxpa. The launch of CSP in Finland, so 2013, this being the 10th year, we were running it, we did it, firstly, in Finland to understand what the state of customer experience was in Finland. And it really works as a tool for people who take it like from organizations who take it every year, they say that it’s a checklist for them that okay, have we been doing better in this part and this area, and they sort of use it as their own tool to reflect on what they have been doing during the year. So it works as a development tool for those who take it as well. And at the same time, we can benchmark now different even continents or countries between each other because we are now it has been in international one for now. And the idea there is that when a couple of years ago, I started to get these questions from from the Finnish organizations that hey, we would love to be able to also benchmark ourselves against the, you know, the bigger world out there. So, so we decided to take it global. And that was why we are now running it internationally all over the world. And of course, it will in some areas, like we’re also going to launch it now in the Caribbean, so that they will be now getting the first steps and seeing that, okay, this is where we are now. And maybe in five years time, they will see that what what kind of improvements they have been able to do in between. So basically, it’s a it’s a benchmark on five different competencies of customer experience management, and you get a shoe the same index, which is telling you from zero to 100%. But how good are you doing? And and there’s four different levels of going to the visionary part of like, you know, exec an executive once and people do say, say that they keep taking it because they are really they really benefit from it. So I guess that’s, that’s the main reason why we keep doing it. And improving it
Gregorio Uglioni
looking forward to share that also to my audience, if you could share that, super happy to share that. And now we looked in the short term, let’s look in the long term. In 10 years from now we are back on the CX goalkeeper podcast and we are discussing about what
Sirte Pihlaja
well probably we are still going to be talking about creativity. I think that’s not going to go anywhere from this world. And I think that I’m actually at the moment I’m torn between these two worlds because I’m so into artificial intelligence and machine learning, and machine customers. You know that I’m following that day in day out and I’ve created my own Python programs for it and learn the language programming and all of that just to be able to do AI stuff. And I don’t know, the customer experience professionals have been entirely understood how big a change this is going to be for us. Because there’s not just chat GPT or open ai ai the API for the for the law of large language model. That’s one thing, then we had the plugins come on top of chat GPT, which gives companies the possibility to offer these services a little bit better than you know, your old chatbots. But what the change that has been happening, like, very, very close now is auto GPT, and baby AGI. And these are the new tools that are 10 times 100x, on what chapter up, they can provide because they are actually launching several autonomous agents that are able to then talk to each other. And, you know, go go do your search online for me when I want to go to, to us and get me the best tickets or best airlines, and then decide for myself, what I would like based on the criteria that I give them, like the goals that I give them, and then just buy the tickets for me without me ever needing to do anything other than lift my finger, you know. And now, it’s still in a phase where you need to have some programming skills to be able to create these autonomous agents. But we are like one step from having plugins on top of auto JpT. And that will certainly changed the themes, because then people will be able to create for each other, all these different kinds of autonomous agents. And that’s when we have the machine customers come into the picture for real, and that is going to change. So totally the customer experiences. And I hope, I certainly hope that customer experience professionals or practitioners are now looking into these things.
Gregorio Uglioni
I think what you what you’re saying is extremely important. And yes, we need to take care also about about this topic. We are coming to an end of this game, but I still have three questions in the extra time short question with short answers. Is there a book that you would like to suggest to the audience that you during your career or during your life?
Sirte Pihlaja
Well, of course, I would have to plug a plug in here, the CX two and CX three books I, but not because of my own chapters. But but because of all the knowledge that has been shared by the 20Plus, other authors of those books, I think that they are really gold mines. As such, and the chapters are so easy to read that I definitely recommend those other than that probably be mentioned several times. But Ian Golden’s customer, what is one of my favorite books, and I also love everything, and everything that shows to me it has a creative because he’s really the, you know, we wouldn’t have customer experience management without him so
Gregorio Uglioni
clear. But now that you’re mentioning him, I need to ask this question because I was also to Ian’s attending his master class. And it’s really clear which colors of each post-it we are allowed to use while we are doing journey mapping. And therefore the question that I have to you is you are also so picky when, with the colors of the bricks that people are allowed to use during the serious play. It’s the same.
Sirte Pihlaja
Yeah, that’s actually the short answer is no, but the thing is that people they take whatever breaks they’re using. And then one of the main, like, most important questions to ask your colleagues from their models is why did you use that color? Does it have some significance? You know, because they might have forgotten to tell something that okay, I use pink here because that dadada and yeah, so there is but then other than that, it might be just the aesthetics that people are using but no, there is no no rules about that because that’s totally up to what you can what you want to do with the table fix.
Gregorio Uglioni
Thank you. I am quite sure that people would like to deep dive also in this topic what’s the best way to contact you
Sirte Pihlaja
I’m very easily you can very easily find me on LinkedIn I’m the only set up there in town or globally it looks like it if you’re writing you will find me also you can go on our webs website on Shirute dot FI slash en if you want to understand anything. Cx play dot FYI is an English speaking site for anything and everything on LEGO serious play. And if you’re interested in joining the same benchmark, the easiest address to go to is Shirute dot FI slash C E M, which then has more like links towards the actual survey
Gregorio Uglioni
and the audience will find all the links also in the show notes. Now we are coming to the last question is a Sirte’s golden nuggets. It’s something that we discussed or something new that you would leave to the audience.
Sirte Pihlaja
Sure. I’m going to tell you a story to back my, my golden nugget, George land was was an researcher in 1965, who created this test for the NASA back in the day. And he’s his idea was to create a test that would distinguish between the people who applied for NASA to be become their engineers and personnel to find everybody who was on a creative genius level, because they needed to really find the cream of the crop. And he created this test. And he actually took 1600 children aged four to five years old to take the test before, you know, to make it a really scientifically proven that what his findings had been from that. And he realized that when they were only five years old, those people, those little kids 98%, out of the them were on the creative genius level. Then he took the same children when they were 10 years old. And they were there were only 30%, who made this level. And guess what happened five years later, there were only 12% of them who managed to be creative on this one day scale. And I think that that’s what he is he and his George Landan and his colleagues that then what they came up with was that we are really drained from our creativity when we grow up from being children to adults, so that there’s something terribly wrong with our school system, that everybody loses their creativity, creativity when they come to the business world when they would really need it. And he has actually taken this test to over 1 million adults after that. And regularly he gets only 2% of adults who get on this creative genius level. So that tells you a little bit that there might be something like a small bit of truth in this. And my golden nugget based on this story is really that I don’t think that we are you know, people are creative, or they’re not creative, that that it’s something that you’re born with. I do think that it is something you’re born with, but everybody is. So it’s just a question of us. Finding that five year old within us to understand an unlock the creativity that we all have inside of ourselves.
Gregorio Uglioni
Thank you Sirte. This was an outstanding conclusion of the podcast. Please stay with me to the audience. It’s everything. I hope that you enjoyed this discussion as much as I did. We discussed about Lego series play. I think it was super interesting. And contact me contact Sirte. If you have any questions happy to direct you to Sirte in order to kick off the discussion. Thank you very much. And bye bye.
Sirte Pihlaja
Thank you, Greg. Thank you for inviting me and hope to hear from everybody soon.
Gregorio Uglioni
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